Founder of Nurses for Nurses, Jennifer Crow

[00:01] Michelle: I want you to think outside the box for a moment. What if there was a platform where nurses could connect with other nurses to network, share ideas, build friendships, and support each other with valuable resources? A place where nurses can buy and sell with fellow nurses across the nation, amplify their voices, and advocate for their profession? You might think I'm indulging in a fantasy, but it's not a fantasy. It's a soon-to-be reality. All because one nurse, Jennifer Crow, dared to dream. Jennifer created a social media platform called Nurses for Nurses. The idea was born during a particularly rough stretch of night shifts, and it was during these exhausting moments that she felt a collective desire for something more, a longing for unity, support, and a shared sense of purpose. The platform is set to launch in September 2024, and I believe Jennifer's vision will transform the nursing profession. I've said it before and I'll say it again, nurses who support nurses have all of my respect. In the five-minute snippet, get ready for a short history lesson. Well, good morning, Jen. Welcome to the podcast.

[01:41] Jennifer: Thank you, Michelle. I'm so happy to be here.

[01:44] Michelle: I am happy that you are here as well because I'm really excited about something you're doing, and you're here to talk about an organization that you founded, and it's called Nurses for Nurses. I saw you on LinkedIn and I was just immediately intrigued. I said I need to know more about that. So why don't you tell us about what Nurses for Nurses is about?

[02:08] Jennifer: So Nurses for Nurses is going to be a social media network for all nurses to come in and connect with each other. I'm building a network of nurse innovators and entrepreneurs and nurses who are doing great things out in the community all over, I didn't know how many of us are out there, but I'm building this network of nurses to have a space to basically show off what they're doing. We are going to launch in September, and when I launch, what I'd like is to be able to have nurses come into the space and be inspired by all of these great things that nurses are doing. And if they're in a space where they're not happy with their job right now, maybe they find some inspiration to start a business or to move on to a different space. So social networking, both, but on more of a professional level nurses can come in and build the career of their dreams.

[03:17] Michelle: That's fantastic. I'm always amazed by nurse innovators and how they come up with ideas and I love the idea of it. I became a member. I'm so excited for when you launch. 

[03:32] Jennifer: There's going to be a special space for podcasts, so you'll be able to click on a link and find all of our amazing nurse podcasts. And they're a lot of really good ones, yours included. So I'm very excited about that as well. On top of the social networking aspect of it, that's going to be very resource heavy where I'm working on basically just finding anybody that wants to join any resources out there. There's so much that I can include in there kind of curating this big database of everything for nurses. So on my website right now, I've got kind of a list of what I am working on building. So when we open, we'll have all of these resources at our disposal. And so yes, employment resources, not just like a job board, but more of like knowing about your employment rights and responsibilities. And then hopefully some links to advocates that help if you are facing anything with your employment advocates that can help you go through that. Mental health resources. There are a lot of nurses that are in the mental health space specifically for nurses. We took a big hit with COVID and I think a lot of us are, you know, there's a lot of us that are still kind of really struggling from that and it's important to check in on your mental health and just a mix of everything, just everything that you think that would help you in your career. That's what we're trying to build. So I'm very excited about it. I think it's going to be a great resource for nurses and, yeah, I just, I'm excited to see what it turns into. I think it's going to be this great grassroots, like, movement and I just foresee it just gaining traction and really picking up once it launches.

[05:24] Michelle: Yeah, I am really excited, too. And imagine back when we were new grads and if we were just joining the nursing workforce and we had a resource like this, it would be amazing. It probably would have changed our lives in a lot of different ways and maybe sent us on a different trajectory. But that is fantastic to have all those resources that nurse heavy and things that we need. So would you say, Jen, that your site will be primarily for nurses? Like, are there any other disciplines that you see being able to access Nurses for Nurses?

[06:04] Jennifer: I think I would like to open the door at the CNA level because so many nurses start out their careers as CNA's and I want them to be inclusive and I want, you know, we want CNAs to grow into their careers too if they want to work towards being a nurse in the future. It's really nice to have that community around you already. So CNA's, there's also going to be spaces for students. I'd love nursing students to go in there and be a part of the space, too. I think one of the things that I was really missing when I was in school is I didn't feel that nursing was like a community type of career until just recently. I've always kind of felt like you're just kind of on your own doing your own thing and we see why a, we cover our own person and I've never felt community until now. And so I think that we've been building a community of supportive people. Yeah. I foresee everybody from the CNA to the nursing student level and then all the way up to advanced practice. I don't know if it'll be a space where for MD's, I'd like it to speak to the nursing profession specifically.

[07:17] Michelle: I love it. Yeah. And like you said, if you build it, they will come, right?

[07:23] Jennifer: Yeah.

[07:23] Michelle: And, yeah, I see that happening. I love that you're including nurse aides because I started out as a nurse's aide and I had so many nurse mentors through my, I worked as a nurse's aide through school. So for five years, I worked as a nurse's aide and I had physicians that were teaching me about anatomy and physiology and I had nurses that were mentoring me about, you know, they knew I was going to be a nurse and they're like, okay, when you're a nurse, then you got to do this, that and the other. And it was just a wonderful song. I'm so happy that you're including nurse aides in that as well. What is your goal for Nurses For Nurses? What do you hope to accomplish?

[08:12] Jennifer: At the end of the day I think what I'm looking to accomplish is, I mean, my dream big plan is that it's a, the biggest network of nurses that we've ever made and it gives spaces for nurse advocacy type of groups like the Nursing is STEM movement and the Commission for Nurse Reimbursement movements like that to be able to give nurses the information about those types of groups so that they can get involved. And you, you know, see stuff on more of like a national stage that, you know, we are, there is work out there that is being done that is going to better the profession. And so I think it's hard to dispense that information right now because everybody is just kind of everywhere. And so my, that's the goal is to, is to have one space for nurses to come in and find these, these people that are doing incredible things and join their movements and join their causes and make changes for the better, for the betterment of our, of our profession. There are a lot of changes that need to happen if we're going to be a sustainable type of career path.

[09:28] Michelle: Yeah, agreed. And those movements that you spoke of, like Rebecca Love, but the Nursing is STEM Movement and anybody can find them on LinkedIn, you know, if you just look. But to have everybody central, I think that those movements are just going to gain so much traction and they're really going to take off. So you'd been a nurse for eleven years and what did you need during that time that you didn't have that may have motivated you to create Nurses for Nurses?

[10:09] Jennifer: So, basically my whole career trajectory has been I started in like a float pool type of space when I was a new grad. And if you didn't get floated off to a unit, you got to swat the hospital, which is basically rounding on the hospital and helping just wherever you can. You had like a pager at the time and they page you and you go start an IV. So I've always been in the helping other nurses type of like, mindset. And then I moved into this recruitment position and that was great. Helping nurses bring new grads into their first nursing job was one of the most rewarding things I think I've ever done. And then now I'm still working as a house supervisor. And I just, I feel like what I didn't have going into nursing, like I mentioned earlier, was really a sense of community. There's nobody out there to advocate for us. Especially if you're in a hospital setting, you're kind of on your own. I just feel like once we can create community, then the advocates are going to start kind of coming out of the woodwork to help nurses realize that your feelings of isolation, your feelings that, you know, this is how your healthcare facility is treating you or the resources that they're getting rid of, maybe that's not right. And that kind of helps us to kind of band together and create more movements out there that, you know, that, like I said, we're going to help better the profession in the long run.

[11:50] Michelle: So, I mean, it sounds like you've been an advocate and an activist, a mentor throughout your career, and you're continuing that. And the definition of an activist is advocating or opposing a cause or issue vigorously. So would you call yourself an activist and an advocate?

[12:14] Jennifer: I'm definitely getting more comfortable being out there. It's terrifying getting out onto your own and putting yourself out publicly and speaking out about some things. But the more you do it, the more people are starting to, like, they support you, and that helps you gain that confidence to, you know, to keep going. That's how I feel like I'm gonna grow into that activist role. You know, this is my first time ever putting myself out there publicly. I don't really even have, like, much of, like, a Facebook page. So, yeah, I would. I guess I'd consider myself an activist now, but I'm excited about what I'm going to become in the future because I think it's just going to get bigger and better.

[12:58] Michelle: Yeah, I think when you call attention to issues within the profession, in whatever form you're doing, if you're calling attention in a great way. I love my profession of nursing for these reasons or, you know, these are the things that we need to fix. I think that people see that and it resonates with them, and they want to jump on board and become activists themselves. You know, they're kind of, like, behind you, like you. Yeah, that's not right. You know, let's change that. Or, yeah, this is a great part of the profession. Like, let's shine more light on this. So how can nurses get involved in activism and just being advocates for the profession?

[13:48] Jennifer: It's gonna start with your mindset. You have to have the mindset that the profession can change and that things can get better. I think that that is kind of the start of it. And then looking into your community spaces, seeing what nurses are doing around you and, you know, joining on with them, you know, your facility is working on unionization. You know, join up and be a part of that. You can be there, like the union representative for your organization. You can get out and you can, you know, start. Start a podcast and, you know, host people who are doing things and help support them that way. I think that there's a lot of opportunity to kind of get out there and, you know, to get the word out or join some of the bigger, you know, movements, like the commission for nurse reimbursement. There are other ones, too, but I think that's how you get started, is, you know, you got to get into that mindset that this can get better. I think this is the time that nursing is going to change. I just, there's things happening and there's wheels turning and moving, and I think that more and more people are stepping into the light and realizing that there's so much better that we could be doing for our career. Yeah.

[15:09] Michelle: Yeah, I feel that, too. I feel like we were in our cocoons for so long, and now we are just turning into these amazing butterflies and spreading the word that it doesn't have to be like this. We don't have to accept this. Things that are not working well for us, that we can change, but the change begins with us. One person at a time, right? And we can see different movements, and it's like misery loves company. We can complain about things that are not great, but to rely on someone else to change that, you need to change that mindset, like you said, and the change starts with you, so that's great.

[15:53] Jennifer: But also getting yourself out of the space where you are working so much, you are too tired to do anything else. That's the space I was in through Covid and a little after Covid, you know, picking up shift after shift after shift, you know, you're just exhausted and you don't have any bandwidth left you to just come home and flop into bed and watch Netflix and just don't want to care about anything else. And so if you find yourself in that space where you just, like, you don't have anything left to do anything else with, that's something that you should look deep within and say, does this really work for me? Is this really what I want out of this career? Do I want to just work myself into an early grave because that's how I make money? Or are there other ways to make money? Can I start a business? That's another reason why I got into this is just. I was just working way too much. And the freedom that this is hopefully going to give me is. I'm very excited about it. Hopefully. I know it's going to be a lot of work, but good work.

[16:56] Michelle: You know what? It is a lot of work. I will tell you, that anytime you start something new, there is a huge learning curve, as you have probably already discovered. And like you spoke of earlier, it's hard to put yourself out there. You feel like, so naked, just like, oh, man, I'm just exposed. I'm here, but it's so worth it, right? And I've talked to so many nurse entrepreneurs, so many nurse innovators now that have really freed up their life and made it what they want and continue to stay in nursing because they love nursing, but they want more control over their finances, their time, their freedom, their future, their, you know, their mood. It's no great life to work yourself so hard and come home and just be a zombie to your family and yourself. And I was there, you know, I was totally there, and I just had the good fortune to be able to retire. And I think Covid, as you said, shone a light on all of our inadequacies as a profession and as nurses in general, and we're just starting to come out and recover from that, and it's like, man, the sky is the limit now. Watch how high we can fly. Right?

[18:23] Jennifer: Exactly. Yeah. Exactly.

[18:25] Michelle: Yeah. Well, what is your why Jen? You know, why did you become a nurse, and why do you continue to be a nurse?

[18:33] Jennifer: I started nursing school in my mid-twenties. I was working as a supervisor for this, for the court system in the domestic violence office. My whole life, I've always just wanted to help people and do good in the world. I found really quickly that the court system is a very reactive system. There's not a lot of proactiveness that goes into it. And so I started looking at other career paths, and I had this. There was an older security guard at the courthouse. It was just like, I don't know. We were just really good friends. And his wife was a nurse, and so he was the one that really kind of inspired me. He was like, you could do anything with your nursing degree. My wife is so, you know, she's so amazing. She's done this and this and this, and. And so that's what kind of got me interested in it, and I just took what? Took it one step at a time. You know, you fill up that FAFSA and get your student loans in order, and. And, yeah, it just kind of all fell into place. It was a ton of work, but it definitely worth it. And I have a career now. That is just incredible. I can't believe how far it can take you. You know, you can do anything with a nursing degree. It's really incredible. It's the best degree out there.

[19:48] Michelle: I feel the same. And, man, what an inspiring story. It's like you took advice from somebody that you knew and trusted, and it opened up this whole world for you. Right? I mean, that's just. It's just fantastic. Thank you for sharing that story. I do love hearing the stories of how nurses got into it and why they stay. So thank you. Yeah. Well, as I said earlier, I became a member of Nurses for Nurses, and I'm really excited about that. But what can we expect to find as members of your organization?

[20:25] Jennifer: So, members, when you come into the site, you're going to have your own profile page. You'll have the back end of your page, you know, the personal information stuff that's just viewable to you. But then on the public side of your own page, it reminds me a little bit of like an Instagram page where you can, it has like a wall of links and articles, pictures, whatever you want to post in there. Your podcast, like, any type of link, can go on your public-facing page. There's a live discussion feed. There's a member directory in a business directory, and then there's going to be other links that are going to take you to different places. We're developing a marketplace as well. So nurses that have businesses, you know, I've got friends that are very crafty and make beautiful crafts and sell them. And so a space for that and, you know, books, you know, classes, anything that you think that you can really sell on there. But it's nurses supporting nurses. So, you know, if you want to go into the nurses for nurses marketplace, there's going to be anything that nurses create and want to sell in there, and then there's also going to be groups within the site. So if you have a business that has a community behind it that you're giving, you know, that's like a membership-based community. Community. You can actually do that. You don't have to build your own website. You don't. I mean, you can, but you won't have to. You can host your community right within the site. But, yeah, private groups, public groups. And there are also some features to the site that I'm really excited about. As I mentioned about nursing students, there is a portion of the site called projects, and it's where multiple people can work on one project within the website and kind of showcase what they're doing. And so they can post that to the live feed. Nurses everywhere can see what they're doing, their Capstone projects, or if it's a nonprofit group that is working on a project, they can see that and make comments on it and help get the messaging out there. Yeah, I love looking at the Capstone posters. That's one of my favorite things to do at those nursing conferences. There's so much work, and that's amazing work. What they're doing. And if you really look into, like, the nitty-gritty of what these, like, what the students or the nurses are doing, like, that's an incredible amount of work that goes into those, into those projects. And a lot of the times, there's a lot of really great benefits that, you know, whoever they focus their project on, you know, they reaped a lot of benefits from nurses working with them. So I'd love to showcase that more.

[23:15] Michelle: That would be fantastic. And just, you know, the research and how much you can learn from other nurses, it's, you, you were talking about the Capstone project being a lot of work, and, you know, what you're doing is a huge amount of work. And so I have to know personally, you know, because starting a podcast again, a lot of work, building the website, all of that. But are you doing this all yourself, or do you have a team helping you? How is that working?

[23:45] Jennifer: Right now? It's just myself and my husband that I tag in, but I do have some, I mean, it's, I'm working with web developers, so they're, you know, I just kind of say I need this. And they're, you know, that's what makes it happen. And they do it magically, like in whatever thing that they put into the computer and spits out the thing that we want. So that's fantastic. It's really great to have them, but for now, it's just, it's just me. And, you know, it's all paid for by my overtime, and I'm hoping to, you know, once we launch and things get bigger, I'll definitely probably need more help going into it. But right now, when everything's kind of in the web development space, you know, it's, it's just me.

[24:28] Michelle: Wow. I have so much respect because I know how difficult it is. And again, you know, I will tell you it is worth it. After doing this for almost two years, it is very worth it. But in the beginning stages, man, it's just you're, you're full of angst every day, right? Yeah.

[24:47] Jennifer: Yeah. My biggest fear is like, this going out into the world and it doesn't function right or trying to make it as perfect as possible, but also trying to do it on a deadline.

[24:58] Michelle: You know, we are perfectionists. I think a lot of us in the profession are perfectionists. And I, too, was trying to make everything perfect before I launched and talked to another nurse podcaster. And so I had this advice that you have to have so many episodes in the can before you launch, and, and she was like, no, no, just do it. Just go, just do it. And like, seriously, the next day I did it. But I needed that. I needed somebody to tell me, just do it. Like, stop waiting because I was in analysis paralysis, like really bad, right? And it's never going to be perfect. And guess what? When you launch, there are going to be problems. Just go into it knowing there will be problems and it's okay. You're going to fix them and people will see that you're human and it's okay. I've made a lot of mistakes and I'm here to tell you it's okay.

[25:57] Jennifer: Yeah, I think authenticity can be our best friend sometimes.

[26:01] Michelle: Yes. We'll remind us again when you're launching.

[26:05] Jennifer: September is our goal to launch. So somewhere in September.

[26:11] Michelle: Wow, sweet. Okay, well, got a couple more questions for you as we kind of round this out. And this is a question I've been asking recently, pretty recently in the last few months. Is there someone you recommend as a guest on this podcast?

[26:29] Jennifer: I have a lot of someones I'd recommend, but to narrow it down, I have some really great supporters that I saw the vision right away and have been there to support it. And so I'd like to kind of tag in Lacey Hess, she does a business that helps parents coach parents who have young children and she does like, sleep coaching for their children. And so I didn't even know that was something that you could have. And I wish I had something like that when my son was little. But, you know, she's changing lives by getting people the sleep that they need.

[27:07] Michelle: Yeah, that's crucial.

[27:09] Jennifer: Yeah. And then Wendy Pereira, she's another one of my supporters. She has a business called Yellow and it's basically an anonymous communication tool that organizations can, can deploy where, you know, it's, it's like instead of leaving a sticky note on your manager's door, it's an online sticky note that says, you know, hey, like, the water cooler broke or, hey, like, we don't have these supplies or this is a problem and it anonymously goes to the correct person that can actually fix the problem. And so I think that type of work is really important. And so those are the two that I'd love to recommend. I've got a bunch more, but I won't take up all your time.

[27:53] Michelle: I love it. That's fantastic. Yes, we will talk after and you can send me their contacts and definitely would love it. That's great. Well, Jen, where can we find you?

[28:06] Jennifer: So my website is www. nursesfornurses.org or you can find me under Jen Crow on LinkedIn.  In the next few months, I'm going to be working on getting more of a social media presence on Instagram and Facebook. So those are the spaces.

[28:30] Michelle: Sweet. Yes. I will put those in the show notes. And I'm following you on Instagram, so.

[28:36] Jennifer: Oh, perfect. I have a profile. I haven't done much with it.

[28:42] Michelle: I saw it. It's really cool. And I love your website. It's fantastic.

[28:46] Jennifer: Thank you very much.

[28:47] Michelle: Love it. Super easy to navigate around on there and find everything you need to. So you've done really well. Very proud. Yeah. You know, I say a lot on this show that I have the utmost respect for nurses helping other nurses, and you definitely have all my respect. I think it's just something that you don't have to do, but I feel like it's something that is so appreciated and valued. So thank you. And thank you for being here today. Thank you for creating Nurses for Nurses.  I see it going really far and really wide, and I'm really happy that you shared it with us today.

[29:33] Jennifer: Thank you so much. I'm so, just honored to be on your show. I've been listening to some of the other episodes and I just love them. They're just great. You have some really cool people on there.

[29:45] Michelle: Yes. I've been so blessed to talk with so many great nurses. It's fantastic. Well, you know, we're at the end, so we're at the five-minute snippet. YOu ready?

[29:56] Jennifer: Yep. Let's go.

[29:59] Michelle: Are you nervous?

[30:00] Jennifer: No, no.

[30:02] Michelle: It's just five minutes of fun.  Okay, here we go. Would you rather be trained in martial arts or boxing?

[30:50] Jennifer: Oh, probably martial arts, I think. I don't know why. I feel like I won't get hit in the face as much, maybe. I don't know, man.

[31:00] Michelle: I've seen some martial artists get beat, but. Yeah, yeah. Okay, finish this sentence. When I am in nature, I am blank.

[31:11] Jennifer: Oh. When I am in nature, I am at home. I am an outdoor girl. I love being outside. I live in Alaska, and this is my world as being in the natural environment. I've always lived in some kind of forested little place, some sort of DIY homestead project.

[31:32] Michelle: Yeah. You are in God's country up there. I've been to Alaska on a cruise, so I saw a small part of Alaska, but just beautiful. So, yeah. Okay. Would you rather be a 911 operator or an ambulance driver?

[31:49] Jennifer: The 911 operator. Those ambulance drivers, going into people's houses and what they face every day. I mean, those people have my respect at the highest level.

[32:02] Michelle: Yeah, that is hard. Right. What is something that you don't mind sharing with other people?

[32:10] Jennifer: Recipes, for sure. You know, my husband and I love to cook. And then obvious is my passion for dogs. I will talk about dogs till the end of time. So if you have a dog and I'm the person at the party that introduces myself to the dog first and then everybody else, that's cool.

[32:32] Michelle: We'll have to talk offline because I am thinking about getting a dog. So, again, I'm in that analysis paralysis, because I'm like, what breed and what size? And, you know, what about dog training and all of that? So, yeah, we'll have to chat.

[32:47] Jennifer: Definitely. Yeah.

[32:49] Michelle: Okay. Have you ever had a roommate? And if so, what did you hate about it?

[32:55] Jennifer: I've had roommates before. I mean, this is years and years ago. I can't say that I hated anything about a roommate. I think it's just it's a different type of living situation, and you just have to be, you know, very conscientious. I think that's what I hated the most, is how conscientious you have to be of that other person, because it's their living space, too. And so, you know, you kind of treat it more like you're both guests in the house instead of both living there.

[33:27] Michelle: Yeah. Again, flexibility. Right. What's the number one thing on your bucket list?

[33:35] Jennifer: It's travel. We love to travel. My husband and I have been to Greece and Croatia. We went two years ago, and it was incredible. That was our, like, big trip, and now we're looking at other places around the world. I definitely want to go to Australia and Japan,. There's so much out there in the world that I would like to go see.

[33:59] Michelle: Those are great bucket list items. What's the main quality that makes a great parent?

[34:08] Jennifer: Patience. And I think that. Yeah, definitely patience. But also love having a very loving demeanor.  My son is 16, and he'll always be my baby. You know, he's just the apple of my eye. I love him to death. But I think a lot of that comes with a high level of emotional intelligence as well. Knowing, you know, when you're getting frustrated, to be able to, like, step away for a second and take space for yourself and. And then come back to the situation so, you know, you're not projecting, you know, your own anger, you know, at the highest level, onto poor little Michael.

[34:52] Michelle: Yeah, no, that's a good point that you make. Emotional intelligence, it's just so important. And my daughter's 37, and she'll always be, you know, the same. My babe. And so it doesn't end. Jen.

[35:07] Jennifer: Yeah.

[35:08] Michelle: Okay, last question. Would you rather discover oil or gold on your land?

[35:15] Jennifer: Oh, man. Well, being in Alaska. Little history lesson. Alaskans gave up their oil rights, and that's why we get our permanent fund dividend. So you see every year that Alaskans get what's called a permanent fund dividend, and it's because we gave up our oil rights so that we don't have the right to mine our own oil. So if I had land in Alaska, I would want to find gold.

[35:40] Michelle: Wow. I did not know that. Thank you for the history lesson. That's very cool. Yeah, yeah, I'm with you. I think gold is the way to go.

[35:49] Jennifer: Yeah. But if I lived in Texas, I'd want the oil.

[35:53] Michelle: Right? Oh, my gosh. Well, this has been fun. You did great.

[35:58] Jennifer: Thank you so much. Thank you so much for having me.

[36:00] Michelle: Yes. I'm so excited for the future of Nurses for Nurses. And I'm excited to be a member. I would encourage nurses to go to your website and sign up to be a member. It's very affordable. And, yeah, I'm just looking forward to the whole launch and everything.

[36:20] Jennifer: Thank you so much, Michelle. We have a pre-launch special for anybody who wants to sign up, it's $100, and that gives you a lifetime membership. Once we do the official launch, our membership fee is going to be more of an annual fee, but not super expensive. Less than a Netflix subscription is what I've been saying.

[36:39] Michelle: There you go. Yeah. When I saw that, I was like, I can't not sign up. Right? It's like, yeah, that's a no-brainer.

[36:47] Jennifer: Yeah.

[36:48] Michelle: So awesome. Well, thank you so much for spending time with me today. Jen, I appreciate everything that you've brought and have a great rest of your day.

[36:56] Jennifer: Great. Thank you so much, Michelle.