Nurse and Podcast Host, Brian Cerezo

[00:00] Michelle: Brian Cerezo is a nurse who likes to have fun, but he's also passionate about the nursing profession and proud about being able to financially support his family. And he doesn't solely rely on his W-2 job. He's made some risky moves by investing in real estate, stocks, and the dreaded crypto. We agreed investing can sometimes be uncertain, but as his portfolio grows, so does his comfort in knowing he's got a backup plan. Brian is also the host of the popular podcast called Direct Admission,  and if you know, you know. He started his podcast to talk to nurses about nursing and all the doors it can open for them, as well as helping them on their journey to financial independence by sharing his knowledge and experiences. And remember what I said about fun. Well, his Instagram is packed full of nursing memes and will have you chuckling in no time. When you watch him on YouTube, you'll see he always has a smile on his face. And during our conversation, I did, too. In the five-minute snippet: Honey, did you order the lumpia? Here is Brian Cerezo.  Well, good morning, Brian. Welcome to the podcast.

[01:41] Brian: Good morning. How are you, Michelle?

[01:44] Michelle: Doing well, this Sunday morning, we just made it through the last California storm for a couple of days, so all we got here was rain. But, man, lots of, lots of snow up in the mountains, so that's always nice to see.

[01:58] Brian: Are you in northern California or southern California?

[02:01] Michelle: I'm in central, so I'm right in the middle. Yeah, I'm just a little bit south of Fresno, California. So I'm in a little town called Visalia.

[02:14] Brian: Visalia, no idea where that is.

[02:16] Michelle: Yeah, well, if you go right to the middle of the state, you're going to find it there. We're growing. We're about, oh gosh, I think we're up to about 170,000 now.

[02:28] Brian: Oh, wow.

[02:30] Michelle: Yeah. But we have to the east of us, the Sierra Nevadas, and man, they look awesome. After a great snowfall, they're just packed with snow,  really nice place to live this time of year. But it does get hot in the summer, so that's the downside. And you are joining us from?

[02:50] Brian: New York, right outside of New York City.

[02:52] Michelle: Wow. Yeah. We don't even know what storms are compared to what you guys get.

[02:58] Brian: It's weird. Yesterday it was freezing cold and raining, and now today it's going to be like 65 degrees and sunny. So I have no idea what's going on with the weather here now.

[03:09] Michelle: Yeah, it can't make up its mind. Right?

[03:11] Brian: Yeah.

[03:13] Michelle: And I heard that you guys haven't had the regular snowfall that you normally have.

[03:18] Brian: No, we had, like, one day, and then, weirdly enough, that was the one day that I decided to not call out, even though the snow was really bad. And then I ended up feeling like I got punished for coming in because everyone else called out, and then I had to do, like, everyone else's assignment.

[03:34] Michelle: Nice. You're like, note to self, right?

[03:39] Brian: Take the PTO benefit time.

[03:42] Michelle: Exactly. Well, I'm really glad you're here today. We met on Instagram, and you have an amazing Instagram. You came up in my feed and so many great memes. I love it. I'm just, like, a meme fanatic, and I'm always like, how do they make these memes? They're so amazing. So immediately, I started following you, and on your Instagram, there you say, DM me if you want to be on my podcast. And I did DM you, but I said, I want you to be on my podcast.

[04:15] Brian: Which is awesome.

[04:18] Michelle: Thank you. And you so graciously agreed, and I really appreciate it because you are a nurse doing some amazing things.  Let's just start out by giving us some of your history. Like, why did you get into nursing? Where have you worked? And then what are you doing now?

[04:37] Brian: So, for history, we could go back to my parents because they are both Filipino. They came here from the Philippines. They were recruited as nurses, so they got recruited to New York City to be nurses from the Philippines. And then they met in the hospital that they work at. And then nine months later, out comes me. And then for a while, I didn't even know what I wanted to do throughout high school. And then my parents kind of just said, maybe just put nursing as your major, and if you don't like it, you could always stop. And at the time, you could directly apply to nursing, which was like, 2006, 2007. And then halfway through it, I was like, why not just finish it, even if I might not fully want to do it at the time, because I want to graduate in the four years and just start my adult life. And then I finished my nursing degree, and then I took, like, a year off because I didn't really know what I wanted. Like, if I really wanted to pursue it, then I took the NCLEx, and passed it, my first job was at an intermediate care facility for the developmentally disabled, which I absolutely loved because the residents there were all, they definitely needed your help, but it was just a really good population to work with. But of course, the pay for where we are in the greater New York City area isn't the best. Then I eventually got into the hospital where I work now, which is also the hospital where I was born and also the hospital where my parents met.

[06:26] Michelle: Wow. That history. When you said history, you are not kidding.

[06:31] Brian: No, not at all.

[06:33] Michelle: That is so cool, Brian. I love hearing the stories of how nurses get into it. And a lot of times it's just not like a lofty thing. It's not like I want to help humanity. I want to do this or that. It's just like I came from nurses. I saw what they did, I admired what they did. And your parents sounded, they sound very wise in that it wasn't something like, you're going to be a nurse. It was like, hey, this is a great profession and maybe you should try it. If you like it, super. If you don't, you can do something else. So kind of pressure is off.

[07:18] Brian: Oh, for sure. And then the thing that was great, my brother's also a nurse as well. He's three years older than me. We saw the lifestyle that you could have as nurses. And that's not just pay or anything like that. It's the three shifts a week or three to four shifts a week that if you have another spouse who's also a nurse, there's someone always home. And that's what me and my brother loved, we played sports, we had after-school activities, and there was always mom or dad home to support us or be there. Whereas some of our classmates are like, oh, I don't really see my dad. I don't really see my mom because they're working all these long hours, but there's always someone home. And that was a reassuring thing for me where I thought that, hey, when I have kids one day, I want to be able to be there for my kids, too, and be able to schedule myself around all that, all the activities. And that was another big driving factor. That wasn't just about pay or just time freedom.

[08:30] Michelle: Exactly. And I just interviewed a nurse leader. Her episode hasn't aired yet, Tiffany Gibson. She's amazing. And she said basically what you did and your parents did know. She has designed her life around these core values of time, financial and recreational freedom. So where are you working right now? Are you in ICU nursing? What are you doing?

[09:00] Brian: I'm in the electrophysiology lab, so in New York City specifically, I don't know if it's everywhere else like Cath lab kind of engulfs the EP lab as well, but here it's separated, so we help with ablations, pacemakers, defibrillators, anything that has to do with the rhythms of the heart and electricity of the heart. I'm helping out with the procedures in there, either circulating or pre-op recovery, but for the most part, nowadays I'm in pre-op and charge nurse role.

[09:32] Michelle: What kind of experience did you have to have to go into that? Like, did you need critical care experience, cardiac, or can you just go into that and get trained?

[09:41] Brian: Oh, yeah, for sure. So for me, I did four years on one of the heart failure units at the hospital where I work. And then after that, I kind of got a little bit burnt out from the floor. Then once one of these EP nurses gave report, after the report, I asked them not to hang up and asked them if there were any positions open down there. I need to leave. I need to get out of this place. Luckily, since it's a heart procedural area, they took my resume and I was able to start there. But now, for everyone that we hire, we do recommend you to have some sort of telemetry experience or be able to be fast-paced like an ER nurse or have the critical care experience of an ICU nurse.

[10:30] Michelle: Wow. Yeah. I mean, your unit seems like a very niche unit and interventional radiology. Those nurses don't leave those units very frequently. Right? It's like they find these great specialties and they stay in them. And so when a job comes available, it's like they get snatched up. What do you think led to your burnout on the floor?

[11:04] Brian: A mixture of things. I loved my coworkers, but slowly I kept seeing them leave, either to go to the CTICU so they could pursue CRNA or they graduated with their NP, or similarly, they just couldn't keep doing the back-breaking work. But there was two things that actually convinced me I had to leave the unit. One of them was, I got attacked by a patient one time, and that was like a no-go. It was one of these things where the patient was kind of like a drug seeker, and they were only ordered for one Percocet. Right. So I went to the patient's room and I informed them. I was like, you've only ordered for one Percocet. I could talk with the providers to get you a second one, but for now, to hold you over, here's that one Percocet that you wanted, and then we'll have to come in here with the medical team and reevaluate. And he didn't like that answer because obviously, he wanted two Percocets. So he just decided to attack me from there. Literally tried to choke me against the wall. We ended up having, like, a little scuffle in the room until other nurses saw, and they're like, you got to get out of here. Can't be fighting in here, and kind of thing like that. So that was one of the biggest things that got me wanting to leave that floor. And then the second one is one of my best friends at the time, he was working with me, and then he got really sick, ended up getting cancer, and he just died. He died pretty quickly. And every time I came to work, I kind of got reminded of him. So I was like, I can't keep coming to this floor anymore. And that was one of the main reasons why I kept searching to get out.

[12:56] Michelle: Wow, that's a lot of heavy stuff. And when your physical safety is being jeopardized by doing your job, that scared the shit out of me. Yeah. And as you were recounting your story, my neighbor, he's since passed away, but he was a nurse for the prison system, and he was permanently disabled and put on disability because a prisoner attacked him and grabbed him by the neck and slammed him against the wall. And that's kind of one thing that if you thought, well, he works in a prison, right? So you think, well, that's an occupational hazard. Working in a prison with violent inmates, is still not acceptable. But it's just kind of like, well, okay, that's a risk of working in a prison, but when you think of a nurse working in a hospital, you just don't think of them being physically assaulted. But I know it happens all the time, and I'm still looking for a guest to talk about that because I think that's a lot to unpack, and that would be traumatizing. So I can see your reason for wanting to get out of that situation, for sure.

[14:24] Brian: Yeah, that sounds exactly like the situation I went to. He literally had his hands around my throat trying to choke me against the wall until I was able to finally snap out of it and be like, oh, my God, I'm getting attacked. I need a fight. Yeah. So that was one of the biggest things. And then, yeah, they didn't even send me home that day. They're like, oh, you could finish your shift.

[14:47] Michelle: That's what my next question was. What did your institution do, how did they respond to that?

[14:53] Brian: So even though I was the one attacked, other nurses felt more trauma, I guess, from it. I guess I had, like, I don't know. So they sent them home. They gave me the next day off, one day off. But then I did get the advice from my manager to press charges, and so we were able to pretty much get this patient fired from the healthcare system so they couldn't come back to any of the hospitals that my hospital was affiliated with and also had a restraining order as well. But I had to do, like, a year-long grand jury court case and all that, just so everything is filed correctly. So I had to keep reliving that for at least another year and a half.

[15:46] Michelle: Jeez. It's just unforgivable what institutions are doing to really not protect us at work. And I've told this story on this podcast a couple of times about dealing with a pediatric nurse, long time, and parents. Of course, the children come with their parents. And we were locked in a room, me and a physician. We were attempting to do a lumbar puncture on this very sick child, and the father barged in. It was a treatment room, and you could lock the door from the inside. It was a very old hospital.

[16:30] Brian: Okay.

[16:30] Michelle: Yeah, right? And so he locked us in, and he was threatening us physically. It was just such a horrible situation. And we were in there for about an hour. He was very angry. We didn't know, what is he going to do. Is he going to attack us? And we couldn't do anything with the child because obviously, he was threatening our lives. And the way that the hospital responded was like, what could you guys have done differently to de-escalate the situation? Right. It was like the blame was kind of placed on us. So really sad. And if I were a lot smarter back then, I would have pressed charges and possibly even taken the hospital to court, too. But that was the 1980s, and there just wasn't a lot of press on it. So thankfully, there's a lot more attention on it now.

[17:30] Brian: Yeah, that's something I thought about, too. When I talked about it with some of my attorney friends and all that, they're like, you could have brought this to the court. And I was like, I didn't even think of it at the time, but that's definitely something that crossed my mind later. And I was like, can't do anything about it now kind of thing.

[17:47] Michelle: Well, those kinds of stories that you recounted, would you say you had a little bit of post-traumatic stress?

[17:54] Brian: I think so. To be honest, outside of bringing it up now, I don't even remember it for the most part. There are certain things that probably just trigger remembering, certain things with the attack, and all that, especially if patients get more physical or mad. Then I'll be like, oh yeah, I did go through something like this before. It's definitely buried somewhere in me and I try to keep it buried because it's just not a fun time.

[18:25] Michelle: Yeah, no, definitely traumatizing. Another thing that's in the press a lot is our mental health as nurses. I think definitely the pandemic shed light on not just nurses' mental health, but really everybody in general. But what are some of the things that you do to kind of get out of your head and calm down and just let go?

[18:56] Brian: So my mom always did this where after work you have 1 hour to vent. Luckily I have my parents who are nurses, my brother is a nurse, and my wife is a nurse. So I have 1 hour that I could vent if I really needed to if I really wanted to talk about something. And then I just cap it at that and kind of let it go. And then for other stuff, I try to find time for myself just to clear my head by working out or finding something stupid to watch on YouTube just to make myself laugh a little bit. But it's usually something like watching something or venting to someone or working out. That's been my jam for the last twelve years.

[19:45] Michelle: Yeah, I've seen your workout videos and I'm like, man, he's getting to it. That's awesome. Yeah, you have to have something. You have to find something that works for you for sure. How about your creative side? Like you make those memes and we'll get to your podcast because you have a very popular podcast and I want to know about some of your processes. But that's a creative process and definitely making memes and all that. So does that help you kind of get out of your head as well?

[20:20] Brian: Oh, for sure. The memes. I wish I got into it earlier because every time I'm always scrolling on my phone anyway, my wife probably hates that I'm always on my phone like that, but I love giggling to myself and it's like, oh man, that's so relatable. And then I was like, oh, I could probably make some of these myself. And then when I do it and then some of them really hit really big, I'm like, wow, there's other people that think the same way as me or something like that. So that definitely brought out the creative side that hasn't been seen since junior high or high school in a while. So that's just a lot of fun to do. And I thoroughly enjoy that.

[20:59] Michelle: Gosh, and I love watching them. That's how you got me because one of your memes came across my feed and then I started looking at your account and I was like, oh, my God, this guy's hilarious. Then I started watching your YouTube. It's just like you hooked me just through your memes. So they're fun for us to consume as well as for you to create. Well, let's talk about your podcast because you have a podcast. First of all, I love the title, Direct Admission.

[21:36] Brian: Thank you.

[21:38] Michelle: Yeah. And I was like, how did he come up with that? And so I want to hear your story behind that.

[21:44] Brian: So Direct Admission, that was one of the biggest things I hated doing when I was on a floor nurse. I was like, oh, you're going to get. When the charge would tell us, oh, you're going to get a direct admission to this room. And then you're like, man, I get no history. I have no idea what's coming into me. I'm going to have to get the whole history myself, get all the meds myself, do the blood work, and all that. So it was everything I hated about not knowing what was coming through the door just to backtrack. I felt like I had anxiety coming to that floor job that I was going to. So I would come in like 30 minutes early just so I could read on my assignment, just so I know what I'm walking into once I get report. And the direct admission thing threw all that out the window. Now I'm perfectly in the dark, don't know anything. And then I was doing a little bit of interviews, like, I don't even know what to call this. I just didn't even have a name for it. But then I was like, what's everything that I hated? And let's try to make it fun. I was like, oh, Direct Admission. And I started googling if anyone had that podcast name. Apparently not. And then I was like, let's just go with it. And if I'm going to interview healthcare workers, I'm sure they know what that is. And let's just run with it.

[23:04] Michelle: I totally got it right away and I love it because it is definitely one of those things that you hate as a nurse because I don't know, we just like to have all of our t's crossed and all of our I's dotted. And when a patient comes to you from another floor. It's like they have a history and a lot of things are already done. And you're right. You're just starting from scratch, and it's incredibly time-consuming. What's funny is a lot of other nurses don't like to help you with your direct admission.

[23:45] Brian: No one likes to help.

[23:46] Michelle: All of a sudden, you can't find anybody, right?

[23:49] Brian: Disappear once that patient comes to the floor with the suitcase. Anybody? Exactly.

[23:56] Michelle: You're like crickets chirping in here. So on your podcast, you talk a lot about financials, and you yourself are an investor in real estate, stocks, and the dreaded crypto.

[24:11] Brian: Yes.

[24:13] Michelle: And so when did you start getting into financials and why? How did that happen?

[24:20] Brian: I started getting into just learning about financials when I was in high school, there was one teacher. He was a social studies teacher. For some reason, I'm blanking on his name. I have his face and his haircut, everything in my head, but I can't remember his name. But he only was teaching for fun. And he did this after-school thing where he would want to teach people about personal finance. And he's like, if you leave here with any kind of education after high school, his main thing was like, you need to learn about how to have your money work for you because you don't want to work somewhere for 30, 40 years. And then all of a sudden you retire and have nothing. And that stuck with me all throughout. My dad always did investing or always maxed out his 403 b, but nothing really more than that. And then I got really into it when I first started my hospital job because I was already getting burnt out. And I was like, I can't do this for 30 more years because he started working at 22. So I was like, technically like 40 years. If I wanted to retire at like 60, 62 years old, I was like, I just can't do it. So I started reading all the books, listening to all the podcasts, and then really got into it and really wanted to figure out how to do it for myself. And there were a lot of bumps along the way, but it was just a journey, and it seems to be working out now, like ten years later.

[25:58] Michelle: You had a very forward-thinking teacher. And that's so cool, especially in high school, because one of the things as adults that we always complain about is that the crap that we learned in high school, it's not applicable to our lives today. Probably 98% of it. Oh, yeah, for sure. And this teacher of yours, he's probably going to hear this and he's going to DM you or something. Like, hey, remember I'm so and so, but the fact that you said he was doing it for fun, that says a lot, right? Yeah, definitely.

[26:34] Brian: Apparently he was like already like a millionaire type guy and he was just like, I didn't know what to do with my time, so I decided to teach social studies. But he really was there for the after-school programs of wanting to teach people like personal finance, which is super cool.

[26:48] Michelle: Yeah. Wow. When you were saying you were a nurse at 22, that's exactly my story. And when I retired a couple of years ago, I had already put 40 years in at the hospital, 36 years as a nurse, and I worked as an aide before that and stuff. And it never occurred to me. I think definitely we're from different generations. I'm about to turn 60 and I'm probably like your parents' age because I was thinking I could be like Brian's mom. I'm probably his mom's age. But I think there was a different mindset in that you got your job for life and you just worked for the rest of your life until you retired. And until I started this podcast, honestly, I didn't know that there was another option out there. There are so many nurse entrepreneurs, there are so many investors in nursing, and it's just exciting to see. And I find myself going, oh man, why didn't I know about this like 20 years ago or whatever?

[28:04] Brian: That's exactly it. Because like I said, my parents are both nurses and they retired at 60 years old. And it's definitely a different time because they were even talking about it themselves, saying like what we did is just put our heads down and go to work, make sure everything's taken care of at home, and that was it. But then one of the things that also triggered me to start investing more, and looking into entrepreneurship is that my godmother was also a nurse as well. And then seeing her work for like 30, 40 years and all of a sudden become sick and then being a patient on the old floor that she used to work at definitely hit me a certain way. Be like, wow, you worked all this time helping people and then now you're in the same bed that your patients that you were taking care of were in. And then it didn't really sit well with me for a while. I could do this for x amount of time, but it's not going to be the 30, or 40 years that my parents did.

[29:14] Michelle: Yeah, those situations really put things in perspective and help you prioritize what you want for your life. So besides listening to podcasts and reading about finances, what other ways did you learn?

[29:29] Brian: YouTube. YouTube university. But it's so hard to distinguish who's actually giving good information versus fake gurus or people just that are money-grabbing out there on YouTube. It's really hard because a lot of the information is definitely Googleable, but there's some people that just have great personalities on YouTube that could really suck you in. And then all of a sudden, there's like a call to action at the end being like, oh, for easy 15 grand, I could teach everything I know. But then you're like, I don't have 15 grand to do that. Or if you do it, I've seen reviews saying I didn't really learn much that I already couldn't have learned on Google or something. So it's tough. Yeah.

[30:17] Michelle: There's so much out there for free. For you when you first started investing, because there's risk involved, right? And I don't know if this is part of the nurse personality, but I feel like we don't really like risk, and so maybe we're not really all in jumping in to invest. So what was it like for you when you first started investing, especially in crypto, because there's so much negative press around that? How was that for you?

[30:55] Brian: Oh, scary as heck.

[30:57] Michelle: Okay.

[30:58] Brian: Super scary. I'm still scared of it today, even though I'm doing well in it for crypto itself. Super volatile. You don't really know what's going to happen. There are so many regulatory things that aren't even set in stone yet, so you don't even know if it will be accepted. It's just as much as I would like to say my portfolio is doing well, it could all go to zero if the United States just decides to say, nope, we don't accept crypto or bitcoin or Ethereum, anything like that. Then once all those big players say no to it, then is there real value to it. So that is the scary part of that. But then for stocks, for people like nurses or anyone in the medical field, we love the control, right? So we look towards data, and then if you look towards the S&P 500, which is the 500 biggest companies in the US, you technically could get like that seven to 10% every year. Generally speaking, on average, you could get that. So that's a control factor. But then I started posting a little bit more about it. Not as much, but I do something called cash-secured puts and covered calls where you have complete control over everything that you're doing, whether you're buying or selling, and how much money you're going to make on that week. So knowing that I have that control helps me build my portfolio. I try to teach it to a lot of people, but it goes over a lot of people's heads because they're like, there's no way the market will pay you a certain amount of money just to put out this collateral kind of thing.

[32:43] Michelle: Yeah. What are some of the limiting beliefs that nurses have about money? Have you run into nurses that just like you said, I don't believe this, I don't trust it, or they have limiting beliefs that I can only make a certain amount?

[33:00] Brian: Oh, yeah. The biggest thing from the broadest perspective, is that a lot of people think investing is gambling, and they're like, why would I do that when I can just go to the casino and just go to roulette and they have a 50-50 shot at red or black? I think the limiting overall belief is that not a lot of people want to put in the time to actually understand how the markets work or how to look at a financial statement, which you don't necessarily need to do. I try to simplify everything for everyone, and for some reason, nurses, doctors, everyone, in my opinion, that is very bright. They seem to like to overcomplicate things, and that's what is stopping people from probably growing their portfolios. Ten x, something like that over the course of a few years.

[34:02] Michelle: Yeah, I think we're super analytical and we can get into that analysis paralysis, and there is some risk involved, and you did say, and rightly so, that we are sort of control freaks. And so when some of the things are out of our control in the markets and such, it makes us feel really uncomfortable. And the other thing that I think definitely throws me off, and I think a lot of other people, nurses included, is like the language of finance. We are specialists in what we do, and we understand everything we do. We understand our jargon, our lingo, all of that. But when it comes to financials, it's like we don't understand the compounding interest and we don't speak that language. We're not literate in financial language. And so that, again, can make us really kind of hesitant to invest. Do you think some of that is going on? And how do you think that we can become more financially literate?

[35:20] Brian: That's 100% true because what I'm going to say is that with how literate we are, with medical abbreviations, with all these QOD, BID, all these random things that if you showed it to anyone else, they're like, you're just throwing letters together. What is that? We are all smart enough to figure out the financial jargon that's going on and becoming financially illiterate, is not a problem. If we could understand all of that. And the hard part is we were taught it. We were taught it throughout college, nursing school, and everything like that. And we learned it on the job. And for the financial literacy part, for me, I was lucky enough to have that teacher that showed us it, my dad, that kind of knew a little bit about investing. But since it's not taught in schools, you kind of have to seek it yourself. And as nurses or healthcare workers or anyone in general, it's hard to pick up a new hobby or want to pick up a new skill or just learn something new in general, when you're so busy at work and then you're tired when you come home, you have family, kids and all that. So ultimately, I feel like it just comes down to the mindset of trying to figure out how can I fit learning about my personal finances in general into my busy day. So it's not that people aren't smart enough to figure it out, it's just finding the time to actually dedicate to learning it, even if it's like a few minutes a day because I personally don't think it's that hard after you just set your mind to it and read a little bit every so often.

[37:16] Michelle: Yeah. I think that's a really good message that for anything we do, right, anything that we want to learn, whether it's a new hobby, a new language, whatever it is, we're going to make that a priority. And if we have to set an hour aside every day or 15 minutes, whatever, we can get in there to learn about it, that's going to benefit us.

[37:41] Brian: Yeah.

[37:43] Michelle: So do you think nurses today need a side hustle?

[37:50] Brian: I just talked about it with someone. Depending on where you work, you can make a lot of money as a nurse in general. Like New York, already making six figures in most New York City hospitals, and then California, like northern California when I was talking with Jason from @nursestoriches, you can make upwards of $200,000. So do you need one? No. But should you have investments? Yes, because not all hospitals or not all medical centers offer that pension where you'll be able to retire and not worry about money. So ultimately, you look after people all your life, all your adult life. You also have to look after yourself when it's time to retire and just take care of yourself.

[38:42] Michelle: Wouldn't it be awesome if we could, as nurses, if we were financially independent, where we weren't dependent on the paycheck and going to work and earning that paycheck, where we had some investments that were making us money and we could go to work and practice our profession and do what we'd love to do, not because we have to, but because we want to do it. And it's a different mindset. I think it would really help with the burnout problem, because if it got too bad, I guess you could take this job and shove it because it's like, I don't really need it. I love what I'm doing. Or you could move to a different specialty so you just have much more freedom.

[39:37] Brian: And that's where the financial literacy does come into play, where I see it with family members and friends that are all nurses, and the inflated lifestyle that a lot of people go into once they start seeing that nursing paycheck or that doctor paycheck, it is better than most of the country. Like, how much money, right? Yeah. And then all of a sudden you see all social media, you're going to see everyone's highlight reel of what they have, and then, oh, I could afford that if I work x amount of shifts. And that's such a weird way. Not a weird, it's a normal way for a lot of people to think. But thinking about buying something with how many shifts you have to work is not a good way to look at finances. Like, I know some people are like, oh, I could buy that bag, or I could buy that watch. If I do three ots or four ots, I could do that. But then imagine that you're doing it for something that isn't going to provide you any extra income, and the only thing that will provide you is like a little 15 minutes of like, wow, this thing is really cool. And then it slowly goes away.

[40:54] Michelle: It comes at a price, right? That Louis Vuitton bag that you're going to work so many extra shifts for, it's coming at a price, literally and figuratively. And I've told this story before, too. Is that in, let's see, the early 2000s? So 2004, and 2005, at the hospital where I was working, there was a big nursing shortage. And so they instituted this thing called extra shift incentive, and you basically got paid a little bit over double time for one shift. And so, as expected, nurses were just picking up all kinds of shifts, right? And I was included. We had two girls that were in college and we didn't want student loans so we figured out, hey, if I work all these extra shifts, we can pay cash for college for two girls. And I did that for a few years, but it really accelerated the burnout because it's just not sustainable. And I was tired all the time. I was not sleeping well. I was eating like crap because I had no time to food prep, and I would get home late and go out to dinner, and I wasn't exercising because I was running at work all day, and I was exhausted. And so it accelerated the burnout. And then I got breast cancer. And so I felt like, wow, that was a wake-up call. Like, you just can't abuse your body and your soul for that long without any shit happening. So that taught me, like, you got to slow down. And I changed my whole mindset about it. Was it great putting two girls through college with no student loans? Yes, but it's like, we would have eventually paid off the student loans at some point, and maybe I wouldn't have gotten breast cancer and gotten burnout and all those things that you say to yourself. So, yeah, that's a really good lesson. You can do all the extra shifts, but there's a price to pay.

[43:26] Brian: Yeah. Well, first, how are you doing with the breast cancer?

[43:31] Michelle: I'm 14 years out.

[43:32] Brian: Oh, that's beautiful.

[43:33] Michelle: Yeah, that was a long time ago. Thank you.

[43:36] Brian: Even though I do overtime every now and then, sometimes when I'm at work, I'm like, should I really be here? So the way I've been seeing overtime, because I talk about it, too, with my wife, me, like, if it's like a short-term goal of getting to a goal, fine, do it. But like you said, there's going to be one point where my body is going to be like, you can't do it. And then do I want the regret of maybe getting sick or missing out on something that my kids are doing? And slowly, that's been making me slow up the overtime, and I'd rather be doing this talking to people like you while I'm home. I'll be done here in, like, an hour or so when I do my own podcast after this, and I'm still home, I'm still working, but at least I know I don't have to commute anywhere. And my kids and my wife are right upstairs. Knowing that I'm not that far away and burning myself out doing backbreaking work just makes me feel more at ease, too.

[44:45] Michelle: Yeah, again, there's just a freedom in it. Right? What would you say to people who say that you are encouraging nurses to leave the profession?

[44:58] Brian: A lot of people are going into nursing for, I'm not going to say the wrong reasons, but a lot of people that I've met throughout the years, a lot of them are only here for the paycheck in the first place. So if they were looking for a way out and they found me, they were going to leave the profession anyway. But for the people that still like nursing, still like doing what they do, then saying, like, I'm encouraging people to leave, you're not going to get rich quick. That's the biggest misconception with investing. Who knows? If you get that moonshot of dogecoin or buy something super cheap and then all of a sudden get that extreme amount of wealth, that's a flash in the pan, once-in-a-lifetime type of thing. And not everyone's going to do that. If you're in nursing and you're thinking about quitting because you see people investing in all that, that's a great plan. But you have to also know that it's not going to happen in a year. It's not going to happen in three years. I think it's like a 5-10 year plan that you have to be super diligent about and have a lot of discipline because one mistake could push you back a little bit, and I don't think I'm encouraging people to leave. I think I'd rebuttal saying, I'm encouraging people to think of ways to make income outside of your W-2 job.

[46:32] Michelle: Yeah, I love that. It's like a backup plan, right?

[46:37] Brian: Yes.

[46:38] Michelle: And I feel like that would bring so many people a lot of comfort to know that I'm doing this right now. I don't have to work extra shifts if I don't want to. If I burned out tomorrow, I could leave all these different scenarios that financial independence brings. So, yeah, very cool. I had to play the devil's advocate for a moment.

[47:04] Brian: And I want to bring up, too, is that everyone that thinks I'm like some guru or something? No, I'm not. I'm a regular person. I'm still working my nursing job. If you watch my stories, you'll see me at work. I'm not some guy that's saying, I used to be a nurse. I am a nurse. I'm still working as a nurse. And this is what I like to do on the side. So I don't want to point fingers and stuff, but I see a lot of people who would like nurses in their bio. I want to help you do fitness. I want to help you with money, whatever niche they're in. But then I see zero nursing content. So it's like, how could I trust someone who doesn't know what I'm going through? That's what goes through my head when I'm going through a lot of people's profiles and trying to see people that I want to interview on my podcast, too. It's like not to generalize. Do you even know what it's like to work a twelve-hour shift still?

[48:02] Michelle: No. You have so much credibility because of all the things that you just said. And so with your friends and your colleagues at work, are you kind of the go-to guy? When people have questions about investing or finances, are they seeking you out and saying, hey, Brian, what do you think about this? How does that go?

[48:23] Brian: Yes, that is exactly it. They'll ask me about their 403 b investments, like which funds am I in and certain stuff like that, and what are easier ways to set it and forget it type of thing. And what could help me get to where I need to be by retirement and all that. And obviously, I'm not like a financial advisor, so I'm not giving advice, but I'm giving my opinion on things. But that's also something that I've been fighting myself with because a lot of other business-minded nurse entrepreneurs are like, you have so much knowledge, why don't you monetize it? And then in my brain, I'm just like, I just want to help people.

[49:06] Michelle: Yeah, that's the thing. I totally feel where you're coming from because same thing when I started the podcast, it's like everyone goes to, oh, are you monetized? Are you going to monetize it? And so in the beginning I was just like, oh, I had all this conflict about how I'm going to monetize. And am I? And then I finally got to the point just a few months ago where I was like, do I need to? Do I need to do that? Do I want to? So I think that's just something when you're considered kind of the expert in your field, that people expect you to say, how much are you going to charge for this advice or that advice? And right now you're just doing it because you love it and you're invested in your fellow nursing colleagues. You know exactly what they're going through because you are living it and breathing it every day yourself. And so you come with so much credibility because of that. Well, let's talk about your podcast, because as I said in the beginning, it's called Direct Admission, and you're on YouTube and you're everywhere else, and you've had some great guests. So why did you start it? What was your impetus to start it?

[50:38] Brian: So I just like talking to people. I like hearing everyone's stories. Originally it was supposed to be just like a healthcare nursing personal finance podcast, but then I ultimately just liked hearing people's stories on how they got into Nursing, and the situations that they were in. And I want to show people that there are so many options in healthcare, specifically the nursing field that you could go into. You don't have to be a bedside nurse. You could be a procedural nurse. You could do audits, you could work from home. There are so many different professions inside the nursing career. Maybe I said that wrong. There are so many careers inside the nursing profession that I've talked to so many nurses who quit nursing, and I asked them why. They're like, oh, I didn't like doing the bedside. I was like, you didn't have to be bedside. Why didn't you look somewhere else where you might have been happier? So going back to encouraging people to leave? No, I'm actually encouraging people to stay in nursing because the pay is stable, and the pay is good. You just have to find somewhere where you fit. It's not a cookie-cutter operation. You're not going to do well on a heart failure floor. If you don't like anything about heart, you're not going to do well just commuting somewhere far away when you could find a work-from-home job or a hospital closer to you, it's all about finding where you could be happier, where you fit, and you could be the best nurse that you could be. And then in being happy at what you do, you could also work at things outside of work as well, to make you even happier as a person.

[52:28] Michelle: Yeah, that's another great message. And it's just all about having options. And I think, again, I'm going to speak for myself. Being almost 60, it's like, man, when we signed up for bedside, we thought that's what we're going to do forever. We never really thought of doing anything else. And what I'm finding out, as I have interviewed so many nurses, is there are so many different specialties within the profession, and it's okay to move if you don't like something. Somebody just told me, you're not a tree, it's okay to move. And a lot of us never thought that that was an option or that that was possible. So I love that you're bringing that to the table that, hey, keep your options open. You can love nursing. If you don't like where you're at, move.

[53:23] Brian: Yeah, it's huge.

[53:24] Michelle: What's your process in finding guests, or do they find you? How does that work?

[53:30] Brian: That's the hardest thing. We talked a little bit in the DM'S, but for the most part, a lot of the people that I had on the podcast are my coworkers or ex coworkers.

[53:46] Michelle: Same. Yeah.

[53:48] Brian: And I'm really happy that they were open up to talking about it. And then slowly, I do DM a lot of people to see if they're willing to come on and chat for like an hour or so. But if you look at my podcast, it's all, guys.

[54:08] Michelle: Come on. We need some diversity.

[54:10] Brian: Yeah, I'm trying, but a lot of people are saying that they're too shy, they don't want to be on camera. So it is tough. Luckily it's gaining a little bit of traction where I'm getting people, like some of the people that are doing memes themselves with them. Official Fit RN. He was really cool to talk to.

[54:36] Michelle: Yeah, I saw that one.

[54:38] Brian: And Giselle James releasing his one this week. He has another, like 40,000 followers. He was really fun. People are actually more willing to come on the show now that they see that I have a little bit of a following and they could see how I interview process and the thing that I send in the email, kind of like what you sent is I have like four questions, and I want this to be more of a talk where we're friends sitting outside having a beer near a campfire. I just want to make sure you're doing good and let's just hang out. I just want to know what's new with your life. And I feel like a lot of people resonate with that and they're like, wow, he just wants to know what I do and how I'm doing it, and let's just talk.

[55:32] Michelle: Yeah. I love your style. You have a very conversational style. And I do love watching YouTube because I can tell you really love what you do because you have a smile on your face throughout the entire episode. And it's so cool to see. I don't listen to or watch a lot of podcasts on YouTube. I mainly listen because I walk a lot, and so I listen on, and so I don't get that visual. And that visual is really important, I think, and I love it. I can tell that you really love what you're doing, but what do you love most about podcasting and what could you do without?

[56:23] Brian: The thing that I love most about podcasting is definitely just talking to people. My wife will always tell you that I'm a very extroverted person, that I could just talk with people for hours and it could be about nothing, and I'll thoroughly enjoy it. And the thing that I could do without is fitting people into schedules. I absolutely hate it when I already know that. I have a really tight schedule where I have to be, like, Sundays.

[56:57] Michelle: Sure.

[56:58] Brian: Before, like 01:00 p.m. So I could still have time with my wife and kids. And then I already put that out there, that these are the times. And then when I schedule somebody and we agree on something, and then all of a sudden, you're not messaging me back to confirm or you don't show up. I could completely do without that. The scheduling people, people flaking out. Because as you already know, for your podcast as well, this is time. Time is valuable. And you do so much prep to make everything flow in a conversation. And then all of a sudden, for someone to cancel with you, like five minutes before, or for me, a few weeks ago, someone canceled 30 minutes late. Oh, my God. I was like, I've been waiting and I've been messaging. I see that you read the messages. Okay. Yeah. It's like, I could definitely do without that.

[58:04] Michelle: I know. And again, it's like, just like you said, we do a lot of preparation, right? So we do a lot of preparation on paper. We do a lot of research. For me, I look up a lot of articles, and I look up professional organizations and certifications, and then, man, to just have that all, boom, it's gone. It can be kind of a blow to the ego, too, right? It's just like, oh, man. But thankfully, it doesn't happen very often. And so we just keep going. We just keep pushing. Yeah. What's a common misconception that people have about podcasters?

[58:50] Brian: That we're egotistic.

[58:53] Michelle: Right?

[58:56] Brian: Like what I talked about before, I'm a regular person, a regular nurse. I'm not a guru. I have nothing different than what the next person has. It's just, I have a lot of thoughts that I want to get out. That's really it. And I think that's really it. The hardest part for me, was I was talking about it with, I don't know if you know him, Jumer Adeline on Instagram. He's like an Instagram nurse coach. And I was talking with him about, how you deal with all these? So-called friends that really want to support your podcast, support your Instagram growth, but don't watch any of your stuff or do anything like that. And he was just like, you just have to block them out. That's really it. Because I don't know if it's me just thinking to myself if they don't want to support me because they know me or they don't want me to do well. I don't know. I get really pessimistic when I start thinking about that stuff.

[01:00:01] Michelle: Yeah, I think it's the former, honestly, I think they know you so well. And I'll speak for myself, too, as well. It's like all these friends and family, they know you. They know your personality, and they know your values, and they know where you're coming from. And so I think a lot of them are like, yeah, I don't really need to listen because I already know you. That's just my take on it.

[01:00:28] Brian: But you're a lot nicer person than I am.

[01:00:33] Michelle: No, we all go through that. And I think what helps definitely for me as a podcaster is to remember your why, like, why are you doing this? And you kind of have to just block out all the clutter because they're, as your Instagram grows, as your listening audience grows, there starts getting to be a lot of chatter, and then you start getting impostor syndrome, and you're like, well, who am I to have a podcast? I'm not an expert in this, and I'm just a regular person, but then people start really trusting you and asking questions. It can be a lot. And you just have to remember, why am I doing this? And do I still love doing this? I'm over a year and a half in, and I'm not even thinking about next year or five years from now. It's like, I really love doing this right now. As long as I really love doing it, I'm going to keep doing it.

[01:01:37] Brian: Yeah.

[01:01:38] Michelle: So just with anything else, remembering your why.

[01:01:41] Brian: Yeah, I'll definitely keep that in mind.

[01:01:43] Michelle: Yeah. Well, as we get ready to close, I have a couple more questions for you, and this one I just recently started asking, so you're going to feel on the spot and you don't have to reply right now, but is there someone that you recommend as a guest on this podcast?

[01:02:00] Brian: Yes, I do. There are two people that I talk to pretty frequently. One is if you like to hear funny and creator-type stuff. What's his name? Josel James. He had, like, a very viral Instagram and TikTok about putting in IVs, and he was one of the most fun interviews I've ever done. Another one is his Instagram is the urban nurse, Tyron Tyson. Yes.

[01:02:36] Michelle: Okay. I just started following him.

[01:02:41] Brian: Like, after the interview, we became actually really good friends. We actually call each other and talk about just business, nursing, and stuff. Like, is. He is definitely a mind to pick. 

[01:02:54] Michelle: Yes. I love it. Well, thank you for those recommendations. So where can we find you, Brian?

[01:03:00] Brian: You can find me on Instagram @brianbenjiern and also on YouTube at brianbenjirn.

[01:03:08] Michelle: Yay. Well, I will put those in the show notes for everybody who wants to find you. And thank you for coming on today and talking about your work in finance and investing as a nurse and of course, your podcast, which is amazing. And, you know, at the end, we do the five-minute snippet. So are you ready for that?

[01:03:30] Brian: Let's do it.

[01:03:32] Michelle: Okay. It's five minutes of fun. Here we go. So, the first one is actually a scenario. You're at a concert, and the band or artist invites you on stage to sing with them. Which band is it, and what song are you singing?

[01:03:52] Brian: The band would be Yellow Card, and it'll probably be Ocean Avenue is a song because it reminds me of my high school.

[01:04:00] Michelle: I love it. Okay, would you rather have unlimited battery life on all your devices or have free wifi wherever you go?

[01:04:10] Brian: Oh, dang. Maybe the wifi. So I could at least get in contact with whoever I need.

[01:04:18] Michelle: Just like, on the fly, right?

[01:04:20] Brian: Yeah.

[01:04:21] Michelle: Okay, this is favorite. So, favorite local cuisine.

[01:04:26] Brian: My favorite local cuisine near me is currently all about Korean fried chicken.

[01:04:34] Michelle: I didn't know there was such a thing.

[01:04:36] Brian: You should try it. It's like a double deep-fried chicken. It is so good.

[01:04:42] Michelle: Sounds so healthy.

[01:04:44] Brian: It's not, but it's so good.

[01:04:47] Michelle: Oh, my gosh. Okay. Would you rather have a third nipple or an extra toe?

[01:04:55] Brian: Maybe an extra toe.

[01:04:58] Michelle: Yeah. I don't know if anybody would be like, yeah, third nipple for me.

[01:05:02] Brian: Yeah. What do they call that in Friends? A nubbin.

[01:05:07] Michelle: That's right. Okay. This or that. Driver or passenger?

[01:05:12] Brian: Driver.

[01:05:15] Michelle: Again, all of us control freaks, right? I don't do well as a passenger. Would you rather have to wear every shirt inside out or every pair of pants backward?

[01:05:29] Brian: Inside-out shirt.

[01:05:31] Michelle: Some shirts are made to look like they're inside out, right?

[01:05:34] Brian: Yeah.

[01:05:35] Michelle: It would be weird wearing your pants backward.

[01:05:38] Brian: Yeah.

[01:05:39] Michelle: Although scrubs. You probably couldn't even tell, right?

[01:05:42] Brian: That's true. That is true.

[01:05:44] Michelle: Favorite food at a work potluck?

[01:05:50] Brian: Potluck would probably be either lumpia or, like, sushi bake. A lot of people have been doing that lately.

[01:05:58] Michelle: And do you bring the lumpia?

[01:06:01] Brian: If my wife orders it.

[01:06:05] Michelle: My wife orders it. Oh, my gosh, I love Filipino food. Okay, would you rather travel the world for free for a year or have $50,000 to spend however you please?

[01:06:20] Brian: Probably $50,000 to spend however I please.

[01:06:25] Michelle: I knew you were going to say that, because I was going to say, he's going to say, I would have that. So I would invest it because I.

[01:06:31] Brian: Feel like I'd be able to make enough money to travel with the money.

[01:06:35] Michelle: There you go. A twofer, right? Horror or comedy?

[01:06:40] Brian: Comedy.

[01:06:45] Michelle: Yeah, for sure.

[01:06:46] Brian: I can't do horror. My wife is a horror freak. And I cry. I have, like, hoodies on. I'm hiding behind the blankets. I can't do it.

[01:06:55] Michelle: They always come to me at like two in the morning when I hear a noise. I'm like, oh, shit, I shouldn't have watched that movie.

[01:07:01] Brian: Yeah, my mind starts wandering. I was like, I'm scared, too.

[01:07:06] Michelle: Okay, a favorite family tradition.

[01:07:11] Brian: Every birthday we just have a big potluck. It doesn't matter whose birthday it is. It could be not exactly my immediate family. Like, not me, my wife, or my kids, but whoever's brother, sister, or parents, we always just have a big potluck.

[01:07:25] Michelle: That's a great tradition. Would you rather have a mullet for a year or be bald for six months?

[01:07:36] Brian: Probably a mullet.

[01:07:38] Michelle: Really? Your hair is so short. Yeah, that would look really funny.

[01:07:43] Brian: Yeah, I think that's why.

[01:07:46] Michelle: I was like, he wears a cap in his YouTube videos, so maybe he already is bald. I'm not sure.

[01:07:53] Brian: No, I have a very thick set of hair. I just never do my hair for the videos.

[01:08:00] Michelle: Okay, last question. Rain or snow?

[01:08:04] Brian: Snow.

[01:08:07] Michelle: Yeah. Do you just love living in a place where it snows?

[01:08:10] Brian: I do. I don't do any of the winter sports anymore, but I do like the relaxing feel of staring at snow.

[01:08:20] Michelle: Yeah, it seems very peaceful. And I have no frame of reference. I haven't lived anywhere where it snowed, so I love it. Well, you did great, Brian. I appreciate you just joining in the fun. And we got to know a little bit of your off-duty side, so thank you for that.

[01:08:40] Brian: Of course. Thank you for having me.

[01:08:42] Michelle: Well, it was my pleasure. And I think this probably won't be our last conversation.

[01:08:48] Brian: I hope not. This was a lot of fun.

[01:08:50] Michelle: Super fun. Have a great rest of your Sunday.

[01:08:53] Brian: You, too. Thanks, Michelle.